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| User Info | White House Rallies Markets - For How Long? in forum [Ticker] | |||
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Genesis Posts: 71366 Incept: 2007-06-26 
KD^2 
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http://market-ticker.org/archives/793-Wh....
---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-02-13 08:32:52
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Sideler Posts: 805 Incept: 2007-11-10 
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After reading about this in another thread last evening, I can only come to one conclusion. Sticksave. Thanks for the explanation.
2009-02-13 09:02:49
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Ruffcut Posts: 2183 Incept: 2007-07-07 Mushagain Online
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It appears that burnacne, has run out of tools?
---------- Support locally, and **** off globally!
2009-02-13 09:13:18
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Dashingdwl Posts: 4564 Incept: 2007-06-26 
los angeles
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Hopenchange is a very powerful sauce. ---------- Think Green Tip.
2009-02-13 09:14:36
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Phirang Posts: 8823 Incept: 2008-10-25
bar khoba's revenge
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FX moves also indicated the rally yday. Still short the financials, **** you very much TT. ---------- The Treasury can issue debt on your behalf because the State can and will stomp the wealth out of you and your family.
2009-02-13 09:15:20
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Jstanley01 Posts: 2563 Incept: 2008-07-30
San Antonio, Texas
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Sounds to me like the super-seniors and seniors got sucked into the "house prices can only go up" scam, just like everyone else. If they priced the risk of balance reductions at zero, they did. I'd loved to have been a fly on the wall at the meeting, in which someone at the back of the room cleared his throat and said, "Listen fellas, don't get me wrong, it's a great idea. Only problem is, there's this 'obscure little clause'..." ---------- ...so in short, my fellow Texans, we must secede. "For the children..." --Me
2009-02-13 09:21:07
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Ramblinman Posts: 18 Incept: 2009-01-19 Florida
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Yes This is Taxation with paid off Representation. Time for the pitchforks. Who is going to wake up the Sheeple to this or will they continue to sleep?
2009-02-13 09:26:38
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Muscleknight Posts: 2786 Incept: 2007-06-26 Columbia, SC
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The structure described reminds me of a ponzi scheme. ---------- My Financial Avatars - http://s677.photobucket.com/albums/vv131.... The best lies have elements of truth. If my uncle jack helped you off an elephant, would you help my uncle jack off an elephant? Yesterday's Tinfoil is Today's news
2009-02-13 09:30:16
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Offshoreman Posts: 87 Incept: 2008-10-22
Austin, Tx
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Will this be done only with the GSE's? If so, this would put the risk on the taxpayer(if it defaults) since we back them? This is a confusing program.
2009-02-13 09:34:35
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Blankfiend Posts: 1736 Incept: 2009-02-07
MA
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Once again, I have to express how GREAT this blog is!!! Your explanation of the mortgage subsidy problem is very enlightening. I called my Congressman and Senator to issue my protest about the matter last night. I also sent e-mails to the same effect, to my rep and sen, and to the apppropriate House and Senate Committees. Of course, this will do NOTHING other than make me feel good, especially since my Senator is John Kerry. Interesting to watch the turf battle developing in the House over jurisdiction of CDS oversight between Peterson and Frank. After delivering a big blow job to the Wall Street CEO's two days ago, Frank wants to make sure his ABA buds are not exposed to some damn farmer's idea of financial regulation. ---------- My Elliott Wave Blog: http://blankfiendsew.blogspot.com/ Democrats and Republicans are like M&M's - different colors on the outside and full of brown stuff on the inside.
2009-02-13 09:38:01
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Halfbrite Posts: 554 Incept: 2008-10-13
Arizona via California Online
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Informative ticker - you are one smart guy, and I appreciate what you do. Here's a devious possibility (my mind works that way): The FED through TALF partners w/pigmen and buys MBS for say $.90 on the dollar. The White House through treasury uses the last 50B of TARP, leverages it to 500B, and buys MBS for $.88 on the dollar. They create a 3 way "bidding war" between Treasury, Fed, and pigmen hedgie (OR BANK) partners to cut the best deal they can get and still induce private sector capital in, either through Fed or Treasury programs. Kind of like Ben buying the long end of treasuries to compete against other potential purchasers to drive the price up?? There are numerous advantages to the govt for them to do it this way. In the end though, they're just coming up with different methods to "cook the books" and confuse the public as to the true cost to taxpayer of this crap, and to make the banks "solvent" and restart securitization by appealing to hedgies/banks greed. Bottom line, imo, it won't work. ---------- "The Second Amendment is in place in case they ignore the others" "Go Galt,and Go Now!" Last modified:
2009-02-13 09:51:40 by halfbrite
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Henderson1 Posts: 639 Incept: 2007-08-09
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I believe the act requires "unusual and exigent circumstances," AND, not OR. Lehman or Bear Sterns going under the next day, probably meets that standard; Developing an easy, risk free way for hedge funds to make money certainly falls into the 'unusual' category for the Fed, but I can't get my mind around how it is 'exigent.' Any crisis that would require monetary action so immediately that Congress would not be able to act quickly enough to prevent the crisis is certainly exigent. Unless exigent means 'congress can't go home and explain why they approved this nonsense,' some review may indeed be a good idea.
2009-02-13 09:47:51
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Genesis Posts: 71366 Incept: 2007-06-26
KD^2
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It doesn't matter if its unusual and exigent - The fed still does not have the authority to do anything other than LEND in a FULLY COLLATERALIZED fashion. This is BLACK LETTER law. ---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-02-13 09:49:30
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Margincalltime Posts: 830 Incept: 2008-04-01
NJ
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Of course they don't have that power, but they will continue to expand their power as long as everyone is complicit in allowing them to do so. Along the same vein, who's to say they don't "modify" those clauses that force the equal distributions of the cramdowns? Rule of law gets thrown to the wayside, confidence in the system crashes further and they struggle to find more holes to fill in the dam. Didn't Obama say something about us being in a whirlpool? Self inflicted it appears. Nothing they are doing is in the spirit of capitalism. Our government is masquerading as a capitalist government, but their actions scream socialism. Our founding fathers would be appalled.
2009-02-13 10:49:38
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Kuhio Posts: 206 Incept: 2008-12-31
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Karl, sheer genius - absolutely the best analysis. Still, you need to ask yourself this question: why are they doing it? Let's simplify the query by reducing the motivations to either bad or good intentions. Bad Intention (BI) - Bernanke & crew are engaging in nefarious acts to expand their power, protect friends, pigmen, politicians, Wall St, 100 richest families, foreign entities, etc. Under this scenario, they are raping the US taxpayer to enrich themselves before they fly off to their private island resort. The BI assumption seems to be a common theme on TF (see comment right above mine). Good Intention (GI) - Bernanke & crew have modeled through your various recommendations & policy prescriptions. (These can be found not only at MT, but many other financial blogs which all promote a 'common sense' approach ie clearing out the debt overhang.) Under this scenario, BB, TT et al have discovered to their horror that this course of action practically institutes a guaranteed system wide failure. In which case, so they are compelled to violate the Constitution in order to try and save it. The GI assumption appears to be wholly devoid of any support. I know you don't encourage tin foil and/or baseless speculation unsupported by facts, so I'm curious why you make an exception to the BI hypothesis? One could just as easily support GI by simply penciling out some financial projections and coming to similar conclusions. I'm inching more & more towards the GI hypothesis. Last modified:
2009-02-13 10:56:04 by kuhio
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Genesis Posts: 71366 Incept: 2007-06-26
KD^2
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Violating the Constitution is not a "Good intentions" scenario - its a "worse than bad intentions" one. The Constitution is not a suggestion. ---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-02-13 10:55:30
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Kuhio Posts: 206 Incept: 2008-12-31
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Either way they are violating the Constitution, no? So you're saying it would be preferable ("Good intentions" scenario - it's "worse than bad intentions" ) that they are taking these actions to enrich themselves rather than a noble attempt (at least in their minds) directed at saving ourselves?
2009-02-13 11:01:32
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Deejunk Posts: 578 Incept: 2008-10-11 Now DC - Solar Power.
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That's the "oh ****" they couldn't talk about. [****fan] Those banks are GOING down. Here's to the fed for all that you do: ---------- http://www.myvideo.de/watch/2451556/The_.... - I'm seriously ready for inflation, deflation & TOTAL collapse of the US & Global economic & market systems.. I'm the sexy blonde not in this vid but my x is the lead chichen-> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vdFIXsrjk....
2009-02-13 11:02:02
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Margincalltime Posts: 830 Incept: 2008-04-01
NJ
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Exactly. Kuhio- you should read my comment again. It had nothing to do with bad intentions in order to save "friends" on Wall St, but had everything to do with the Fed/Bernanke thinking they know better than everyone and attempting to expand their power to show it. This includes their actions suggesting they think they are immune from the act that creating them in the first place, citing the exigent circumstances.
2009-02-13 11:05:44
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Genesis Posts: 71366 Incept: 2007-06-26
KD^2
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I love the rationalization process but find it ethically bankrupt. Further, I would hope don't intend to run this on EVERY ticker I post from here on. That will get tiresome fast. ---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-02-13 11:06:52
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Eaglewwit Posts: 1885 Incept: 2007-11-30 SoCal
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How is this paper effected in the government/Fed just goes out and buys it from the holder at their mark or par, and then restructures the loan for the homeowner? That's what I thought it sounded like, but then again that is kind of like the bad bank's structure. If it happened as I described wouldn't it end up just being a giant subsidy to the banks and irresponsible home/renters. Perhaps it is a PR stunt to get people to think of their rescue plan as a rescue of homeowners/renters. Either way it pure bull**** through and through. Got Pitchforks. ---------- "Not even I imagined we would see trillions of dollars being created and given to the culprits as a means of allegedly "saving" the system. This is not mere Keynesianism; it is Keynesianism on steroids and crystal meth."
2009-02-13 11:34:21
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Genesis Posts: 71366 Incept: 2007-06-26
KD^2
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That's what it sounded like to me too Eagle, but there's no way to know as we don't have detail. The original announcement and Bloomberg's article different SIGNIFICANTLY in what they claimed was going on, and the details COUNT in this case. Either way tho it sucks severely if you're one of the people who did things right. ---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-02-13 11:36:45
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Kuhio Posts: 206 Incept: 2008-12-31
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Actually, I'm one of your biggest fans - I consider MT essential reading. It's quite evident you spend a lot of time and effort crafting your essays. They're so tightly woven & well supported that the conclusions presented are inescapable. You really deserve to have your voice heard and message(s) headed. Unfortunately, that will never, ever happen as long you harbor any illusions as to motivations. In other words, you're nuclear and no one in any position of public trust will allow themselves to be associated with that type of sentiment. Trying to discover motivation is neither rationalization nor ethically bankrupt. It's merely an objective process by which one attempts to uncover the truth. Only from that basis can a meaningful set of counter proposals be constructed which have any 'hope' of 'changing' the current paradigm. All your work & effort to naught. A tragedy, really. Last modified:
2009-02-13 11:41:45 by kuhio
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Genesis Posts: 71366 Incept: 2007-06-26
KD^2
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Discovering motivation with certainty requires information you cannot obtain even if you are allegedly told what the motivation is. I am results oriented. The purpose of chronicalling this is so that irrespective of motivation if the bad decisions are not reversed in time the people will have everything they need to know where to bring the coils of boiled rope. If that doesn't figure into their "calculations" then so be it, but what I have no intention of doing is being distracted by bull****, and GUESSING at motivations is just that - bull****. ---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-02-13 11:49:40
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Anti Posts: 1286 Incept: 2007-10-09
Online
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Quote:The bigger issue, however, is an obscure little clause in a bunch of securitizations. See, a good number of them - especially ALT-A and HELOC paper - have a nasty little clause in them that a modification that involves reduction of the balance (which this plan does) is not taken "up the securitization chain", as is done for ordinary losses, but is instead spread evenly over the entire structure. What is your source for this? You haven't been staying up nights reading these documents, have you? ---------- Health is better than health insurance http://gerson.org/ Over the past 60 years, thousands of people have used the Gerson Therapy to recover from so-called “incurable” diseases such as cancer, diabetes, heart disease and arthritis.
2009-02-13 11:59:13
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