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| User Info | The Idiocy Of The Media, Fed And Government in forum [Ticker] | |||
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Genesis Posts: 71435 Incept: 2007-06-26 
KD^2 
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http://market-ticker.org/archives/1273-T....
---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-07-30 13:42:18
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Trappped Posts: 73 Incept: 2009-02-13 Banned
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"They simply don't care about the truth and neither does the mainstream media." Now you're starting to get it. Junkies NEVER admit they have a problem.
2009-07-30 13:45:29
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Thesev Posts: 395 Incept: 2007-10-30 
Louisiana
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Withdrawn. ---------- Anyone who thinks the great United States can never fall, directly contributes to the forces that will make it so. - me '93 Last modified:
2009-07-30 16:54:35 by thesev
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Guyfawkes Posts: 352 Incept: 2008-09-19 Texas
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I just can't wrap my head around what the end game is. If they all know it's going to blow up (and I assume they do know), is kicking-the-can REALLY that good of an option, or do those in power REALLY think they can avert the almost guaranteed outcome? ---------- It's still "We, the People".....right?
2009-07-30 14:12:30
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Smartfan1 Posts: 31 Incept: 2009-02-17 Planet Earff
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I'ts a Giant GAME liars are going to Hell.
2009-07-30 14:19:12
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Nemesis Posts: 4502 Incept: 2008-01-03
Canada
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What about the nearly impossible hurdle of getting borrowed government funds into the hands of the consumer? Isn't the whole government debt thing a non starter designed to merely subsidize the losses of the banks? I don't see a big increase in government spending, so how can this increase in government debt have a positive impact on the economy other than postponing a collapse of the banking system?
2009-07-30 14:19:32
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Genesis Posts: 71435 Incept: 2007-06-26
KD^2
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It doesn't Nemesis. ---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-07-30 14:21:45
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Whewt Posts: 444 Incept: 2008-03-17
..Isla Bonita
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Quote:I just can't wrap my head around what the end game is. The people left owning the resources will win and the people left holding worthless financial derivatives will lose. ---------- HAS THE WHOLE WORLD GONE CRAZY? AM I THE ONLY ONE AROUND HERE WHO GIVES A **** ABOUT THE RULES? MARK IT ZERO! -Walter Sobchak - The Big Lebowski
2009-07-30 14:21:49
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Superdude Posts: 121 Incept: 2009-06-16
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Anyone ever get that sinking feeling that ignorance is bliss. Think about it. Wouldn't you like to not know when you are going to die? If you know the exact time when you were going to die thats a lot of added stress. You would try to "beat the clock" to make sure your loved ones are okay. You say your goodbyes. Not to mention going on the the h00k3rs and B|_ow benders. But after all that, you still got the stress that your going to die. Now, if you don't really pay attention guess what? Your still buying cars, houses, spending every dime you got. Just like you would if you know the end is near. So who needs the stress.... Sweet Jeebus.
2009-07-30 14:28:04
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Risingcream Posts: 2547 Incept: 2007-09-07
Online
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The outcome is they kill you trying to kill them.
---------- Civilization...ancient and wicked. --Subotai The trees in Siberia are miles apart, that is why the dogs are so fast. -- Bob Hope
2009-07-30 14:33:22
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Sushihorn Posts: 6084 Incept: 2007-10-22
Arlington, TX
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Quote:Anyone ever get that sinking feeling that ignorance is bliss. Occasionally but then I get better. There are things you can do to prepare for this. You CAN mitigate some of the damage for you and your family even if the system chokes. That's why I don't think the death metaphor is appropriate. How about knowing that you're about to have a heart attack and prepare by being in or near a hospital with a specialist on call? It's still going to suck but you improve the odds that you'll survive. ---------- http://jengafinance.blogspot.com/ Stop the looting. Start prosecuting. Do it soon. Or folks may start shooting.
2009-07-30 14:35:05
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Rebecca Posts: 67 Incept: 2009-07-17 Atlanta, GA
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I hate it when the media, the Fed, & the government covers us up in $hit and then tells us its gonna make us grow.
2009-07-30 15:19:57
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Baja Posts: 77 Incept: 2009-06-03 Outback Texas Banned
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"If you're wondering why I go after the media and government so aggressively, this is the reason: The facts are right in front of their face and require nothing more complicated than a 4-function calculator to add it all up. " I absolutely agree, but gee-wiz, it's not just the press: 1. The Realtor misled me when I bought my house. 2. The banker misled me when he gave me the loan. 3. The President misled me when he took us into Iran. 4. The Board of Education misled me about the need for a new high school. 5. The entertainers misled me with FarmAid. 6. My Congressman misled me when he said he felt my pain. 7. The Ford Motor Company misled me when they said chicks would dig me if I drove a Mustang. 8. The Coors Brewing Company misled me when they told me Coors Light would make chicks dig me. Of course the media misleads! That's what they do. Everybody gets it, even the sheeple. The critical thing that we are missing is that SOME PEOPLE WANT TO BE MISLED. I won't go into the psychological reasons why, but they are very real. The fact of the matter is that we bought into two lies as a culture that sealed our fate. The first lie was the belief that if it felt good and didn't hurt anyone else that we were morally justified doing it, whatever it was. The second lie was that government and corporations could replace family in our lives and provide that which family has historically provided. Of course, it was necessary to buy into lie #2 to live lie #1. It's all water under the bridge now. We are in the middle innings of a collapse of our empire. It started when we bought the two lies, which in turn justified our rampant drug use, lack of compassion for each other in pursuit of our own selfish needs, the abandonment of our children and the tolerance of behaviors that, in retrospect, are very clearly self-destructive. I look to my left and I look to my right, I look up and I look down and everywhere I look I see people taking whatever they can with little regard to their obligations to the rest of us. In the face of that, it really isn't surprising that the press would ***** themselves out for a buck. It's your blog and I greatly respect what you write and believe. I simply can't believe you're surprised by it, but it sure sounds like you are.
2009-07-30 15:21:10
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Drake Posts: 939 Incept: 2007-07-27
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Baja you are just further down the road towards acceptance. Disbelief, anger, and acceptance will lead you to the place where you finally realize and accept that NOTHING WILL BE DONE! Prepare yourselves accordingly. ---------- The wise are aware of their treasure, while fools follow their vanity. Reality is the murder of a beautiful theory by a gang of ugly facts!
2009-07-30 15:27:57
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Stoverny Posts: 250 Incept: 2009-02-25
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Quote:
Maybe I'm naive, but I still get the feeling they honestly think they can avert the outcome. They seem to think that if the debt can be amortized over a sufficiently long period of time, it can somehow be grown away when the good times inevitably return, and the pain can be "spread out". Last modified:
2009-07-30 15:31:17 by stoverny
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Striker754 Posts: 142 Incept: 2009-07-09
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Someone accidently hit the 3:30 dump button instead of the 3:30 pump button today....
2009-07-30 15:50:22
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Geschrei Posts: 43 Incept: 2009-02-23
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For some reason the Kubler-Ross Model comes to mind. I think those of us who see this trainwreck coming are all somewhere in the Five Stages of Grief. 1. Denial: "This isn't as bad as it looks - just another recession, a little harsher than most, but not GDII, and certainly not TEOTWAWKI. We'll be fine in a few months." I think we've all passed through this stage, some of us recently, others (like Karl) way back in '07 . 2. Anger: "What the hell are these idiots doing? Don't they realize that they are wrecking whats left of our prosperity? Let's hang these bastards from every lamppost on Wall Street!!!" Still sensing a lot of this stage on TF, and saw a lot of it in the Tea Party protest movement. Frankly, I think I pretty much skipped this stage entirely. 3. Bargaining: "OK, we're seriously screwed. I just hope that scumbag Bernanke can keep kicking the can for a few more months - or maybe even a couple of years - before TSHTF, so I can have a little more time to get prepared." This is pretty much where I am right now. Still working on the last of Karl's Ten Things, hoping against hope I can get them all done in time. 4. Depression: "We're ****ed. Oh ****, are we ever ****ed." For those of you in this stage, you have my sympathies. Of course, I'll likely be joining you soon. 5. Acceptance: "Here come the fireworks. Somebody pass me the popcorn." The lucky few who've made it through to stage 5 are the ones who will likely survive no matter what. The rest of us are going to need a lot of luck. ---------- Go to now, ye rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come upon you. Your riches are corrupted, and your garments are motheaten. Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. James 5:1-3
2009-07-30 16:37:02
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Wawawa Posts: 104 Incept: 2009-03-18 San Diego, CA
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Is not ? Ever expanding debt + paying old debt with new debt = PONZI Welcome to American definition of prosperity. ---------- RAT RACE IS OVER, RATS WON :)
2009-07-30 16:41:01
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Nemesis Posts: 4502 Incept: 2008-01-03
Canada
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I was at #5 ten years ago. 
2009-07-30 16:45:32
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Geschrei Posts: 43 Incept: 2009-02-23
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Great, kid. Don't get ****y. 
---------- Go to now, ye rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come upon you. Your riches are corrupted, and your garments are motheaten. Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. James 5:1-3
2009-07-30 16:53:38
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Magnus Posts: 96 Incept: 2009-06-04 Sweden
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Ignorance is never bliss if you are a curious human or if you like to do constructuve things regardles of how small or insignificant they are.
2009-07-30 17:01:16
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Pondmaster Posts: 65 Incept: 2009-06-30
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Big Lebowski - good flick - good quote I am very interested in hearing anyones ideas of what they see the outcome of this "lie" being , when it reaches fruition and it "ain't workin no more" and everyone realizes we have been lied to . End of political system and economy ? Ok what, whom fills the "vacuum" ? What economy emerges ? What kind of economy? ( leading question ) a One World economy ? (not referring to Bilderburg conspiracy stuff , but other much older info ) Any thought shared would be appreciated . We all must be picturing something . I am . Thanx
2009-07-30 17:07:51
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Wineaux Posts: 131 Incept: 2009-03-23
pure Liquid pleasure
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Geschrei - Your post is apropos for the Forum on Polls. Would be interesting to see what people think.
---------- What wine goes with unemployment?
2009-07-30 17:13:21
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Parcontre Posts: 200 Incept: 2007-12-02
Fort Worth
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Quote:
I'm trying to wrap my tiny brain around that statement. When I think of GDP, I think of factories producing goods, restaurants serving customers, computer geeks writing programs, lawyers writing contracts, etc. It's the total of all wealth that is created, i.e. the sum of all goods and services produced. Now why must we suddenly reduce our rate of wealth creation? That doesn't make sense, unless there has been a sudden collapse of demand, but why would there be such a collapse of demand? Ah yes, because people have borrowed money to finance their spending, thus pumping up consumption, until the point is reached where those borrowers can no longer support their debts. But from whom did those all those big spenders borrow that money? Presumably other people who chose to save rather than spend, and lent out their savings in hopes of having more to spend in the future. So now borrowers can't pay back what they owe, and lenders aren't going to get back what they lent. There has been a transfer of wealth from savers to borrowers, and the savers are getting the shaft because they made poor lending decisions. But for me, the past is water under the bridge, my only concern is what the future holds. Yes, it bothers me a little bit that some spendthrift was able to squander more than he should have, and I'm really sorry about the little old lady who lost her life's savings and now has to live on dog food and sleep on a subway bench. But that's how the cookie crumbles, c'est la vie, das leben ist schwer . . . A market economy consists of an infininite number of transaction, but each transaction consists of two parties: the buyer and the seller, or the borrower and the lender, or the donor and the donee. The economy should always be in equilibrium because every transaction represents an equilibrium, with each party exchanging something that he thinks will make him better off. The economy is always in equilibrium in the same way that double entry bookkeeping assures that a company's accounts are always balanced. So the economy is humming along, and suddenly a lot of people default on their debt. Why must the process of wealth creation slow down? Those who defaulted have reaped a windfall, they no longer need to pay off their debt. Those who lent have suffered a loss, they will be penalized rather than rewarded for their thrift. But in theory, the windfall gains should offset the losses. The only explanation that occurs to me is the shifting of wealth across time. The gain to the borrower came in the past when he received his loan. The pain to the lender is happening now, as he realizes his loss. But that still doesn't quite explain it. The borrower consumed more when he received his loan, but that higher consumption was equal to the reduction in consumption of the lender, also in the past. Maybe I need to go back and analyze the original loan made to the borrower by the lender. Surely the lender thought that his savings would be put to a productive use when he made the loan, a productive use that would generate wealth with which to pay back the lender more than his original loan. And just as clearly, the loan was not put to a productive use, the lender's savings were squandered. Now I'm beginning to understand, and it's not that the economy needs to shrink -- the economy has already been shrunk, and we need to come to grips with the destruction of wealth that occurred in the past. We need to recognize our losses and move forward. Having recognized the destruction of wealth that has already occurred, I ask myself what we must do going forward? And suddenly I begin to comprehend the immensity of the situation. Our society was depending on that wealth to maintain a certain standard of living, and without that wealth our future well-being is in peril. It seems obvious, to me at least, that going forward the wealth that was destroyed must be replaced, and as quickly as possible. We don't need to shrink our economy; on the contrary, we need to grow it even more quickly than before, so that the wealth that was squandered can be replaced before our society begins to suffer serious consequences. But how do we do that? And once again, it seems obvious to me at least, that we need to determine what was done wrong in the past and do the opposite, i.e. the right thing. Clearly, lenders must only make loans to borrowers who will put those loans to productive uses, but we must also increase the total level of savings. The more savings we can put to productive use, the more quickly we can replace the wealth that was squandered. But is anyone out there still saving and lending? You know the old saying, fool me once and shame on you, fool me twice and shame on me. Why would anyone still want to save their money and lend it out after taking so many losses, better to just spend it on yourself. I've got an idea! Maybe if we came up with some system to reward people for saving more and consuming less. But where could we possibly find the means to reward people for changing their behavior? Eureka! I've just thought of a great solution! Let's make borrowers pay more for their loans, and we'll use those higher payments to reward people who save and lend. And we can use that as a way to ensure that loans only go to the most productive uses -- any borrower who can't prove his loan will be put to a use that is more productive than the new, higher cost of borrowing will be denied credit. This is so brilliant, and if we set it up right the system will run itself. I can't believe that I came up with such a great idea. I'm still kind of curious, though, why at some point in the past everyone suddenly decided to start making loans to deadbeats? Maybe it was a new strain of pot from California, they say all the new trends start on the Left Coast. Yeah, that was probably the problem, all those bankers started catching the new buzz, and suddenly a toke and another smoke was the only thing to which interest was paid. There's nothing so threatening to the moral fiber of this country as a pothead making decisions, but I'm sure that going forward only the most sober minded people will be entrusted with such positions of responsibility. ---------- Wherever fate my vessel steers, that image never disappears. In times of joy and times of tears, her song still echoes in my ears. Last modified:
2009-07-30 19:41:52 by parcontre
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Halfbrite Posts: 555 Incept: 2008-10-13
Arizona via California
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KD- You astutely point out that Bernanke and all the wonks are very smart people who know exactly how screwed we are, but are merely trying to kick the can a little longer. JoJo posted this in another forum.http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rep-barney.... If you take the time to read it, you inescapably conclude that Barney Frank is very smart, knows exactly what went wrong and why, but has no moral compass to fix it, hence the idiots kick the can and deliberately mislead the sheeple, as you just stated. I'm in the "acceptance" phase, and life is good again - pass the popcorn! ---------- "The Second Amendment is in place in case they ignore the others" "Go Galt,and Go Now!" Last modified:
2009-07-30 19:42:32 by halfbrite
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