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Genesis Posts: 71366 Incept: 2007-06-26 
KD^2 
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http://market-ticker.org/archives/1528-M....
---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-10-21 08:48:23
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Dji Posts: 718 Incept: 2009-04-21 
Fleming Island Online
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How much has Gov. Motors lost this last Qtr? ---------- What goes up Must come Down- Alan Parsons Project THE TRUTH HURTS! -Dji
2009-10-21 09:01:21
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Iou Posts: 186 Incept: 2009-03-16
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I will never do business with any company that was bailed out. NEVER!
---------- "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves, in the course of time, a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that glorifies it." - Frédéric Bastiat LEFT vs. RIGHT Look up shell game and shills.
2009-10-21 09:21:44
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Lastchance Posts: 1132 Incept: 2008-11-19 Las Vegas
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It really has been quite something to watch long established brand names (General Motors and Chrysler) basically self-destruct. It almost seems like a dream. Then I think of some of the CEO's of these two companies and reality sinks in. Great at reading prepared speeches, but lame when it came to hands-on management. ---------- "We don't quit. I don't quit" President Obama 1/27/10 Man, I would to have him in one of our poker games.
2009-10-21 09:23:26
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Markytom Posts: 217 Incept: 2009-02-19
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Remember when GM bought EDS in the 80's to help change their culture? Ross Perot was then on the Board and kept criticizing GM management. GM management only wanted Perot to go. In 1986 Perot gave, what he thought, was a ridiculously large offer to buy him out: $700 million dollars. GM management didn't blink an eye and wrote him a check. That's when I knew GM was never going to change and would go into a long death spiral although they lasted much longer than I thought they would. Does anyone really think that the culture in GM is going to change now that they have been bailed out, especially now that the Government owns 61% (and will politicize all the decisions made)? I'm afraid it can only get worse.
2009-10-21 09:36:56
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Ribbit Posts: 888 Incept: 2007-09-10 Wales, UK
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"Great at reading prepared speeches, but lame when it came to hands-on management." ---------- Politics is just a shell game. Every time you pick a new shell, it always turns up empty.
2009-10-21 09:49:03
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Pelle031 Posts: 144 Incept: 2009-03-24 
Philly burbs - PA
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Purely pathetic. Both GM's management and Steven's supposed 'shock'. I too will never buy another GM product (I've long since torn the lapel on Chrysler). Though I commend Ford's preparedness and now products, I won't likely buy their products either as their caught up in the same web... I used to be a proud owner of 4 GM products. As of last week, I'm the 'not so proud' owner of 3.
2009-10-21 10:01:29
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Micronin127 Posts: 607 Incept: 2008-01-21
Swampscott, MA
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They'll be bankrupt again in less than 2 years.
2009-10-21 10:10:14
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Chumley Posts: 22 Incept: 2008-12-30 The Great Northeast
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I have been watching the sales trend on autos since the bail out and cash for clunkers. One trend I noticed was GM and Chrysler sales were much lower then the industry average. My hope is this was a boycott by the consumers based on the theft of taxpayer money by GM and team Obama.
2009-10-21 10:30:29
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Ignorantsavage Posts: 85 Incept: 2007-11-27
USA
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I hope We the People are able to stop this government stupidity before their subsidation of failure takes down other automobile companies who didn't manage themselves into the ground...
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2009-10-21 11:25:44 by ignorantsavage
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Theox Posts: 53 Incept: 2009-01-30
People's Republic of Maryland
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I liked this part of the article as well: The cultural deficiencies were equally stunning. At GM's Renaissance Center headquarters, the top brass were sequestered on the uppermost floor, behind locked and guarded glass doors. Executives housed on that floor had elevator cards that allowed them to descend to their private garage without stopping at any of the intervening floors (no mixing with the drones). I'm sure Geithner hangs out with the GS-5s at Treasury too.
2009-10-21 11:27:30
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Jwm_in_sb Posts: 224 Incept: 2009-04-16
California Desert
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My guess is that there aint no GS5's at Treasury.
2009-10-21 12:06:25
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Degaston Posts: 1100 Incept: 2007-07-27
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In case anyone hasn't seen the numbers for this year on auto sales. http://online.wsj.com/mdc/public/page/2_.... We're down about 2.5 million vehicles sold this year so far compared to last year nationwide. And life is really got to be tough for any stakeholders in Chevy Silverado and Chevy Impala models that have lost over 38% of their market. ---------- 8/20/2009: Strong Buy ratings - PACR, GIGM, UNG, CSR, PBW - 10 percent in the market right now with 90 percent in cash
2009-10-21 14:29:40
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Elkad Posts: 15 Incept: 2009-09-04
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Thanks Degaston. Looks like people really are voting with their wallets. GM and Dodge both got hammered in market share. Looks like no-bailout-for-us Ford picked up most of the slack on actual pickups (a need, vs SUV want), nice numbers considering light trucks got hammered as a whole.
2009-10-21 15:52:56
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Mlshawaii Posts: 466 Incept: 2009-05-13
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60-day money back guarantee. Enough said.
2009-10-21 17:11:19
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Neoplunger Posts: 125 Incept: 2009-02-08 N.E. PA
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Over the past year, the domestic auto industry has experienced sharply reduced sales and profitability, large indefinite layoffs, and increased market penetration by imports … The shift in consumer preferences towards smaller, more fuel-efficient passenger cars and light trucks … appears to be permanent, and the industry will spend massive amounts of money to retool to produce the motor vehicles that the public now wants. To improve the overall future prospects for the domestic motor vehicle manufacturers, a quality and price competitive motor vehicle must be produced … If this is not accomplished, the long term outlook for the industry is bleak. -- Source: THE U.S. AUTOMOBILE INDUSTRY, 1980. REPORT TO THE PRESIDENT FROM THE SECRETARY OF TRANSPORTATION ---------- If bull markets climb a Wall of Worry, I would add that bear markets slide down a Slope of Hope. Robert R. Prechter, Jr "Much of the social history of the Western world, over the past three decades, has been a history of replacing what worked with what sounded good".
2009-10-21 18:24:46
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Uwe Posts: 1029 Incept: 2009-01-03
Philly Burbs
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The Ticker wrote..GMAC/Ally is again touting outsized CD returns as one of their "feature products" in a raw attempt to raise capital from depositors Borrowing money from depositors isn't really raising "capital", is it? -Uwe- ---------- “Political tags - such as royalist, communist, democrat, populist, fascist, liberal, conservative, and so forth - are never basic criteria. The human race divides politically into those who want people to be controlled and those who have no such desire.” - Heinlein
2009-10-21 22:52:00
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Blackswan Posts: 3601 Incept: 2007-11-06
Ponzi Roller Coaster
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Chrysler and GM will eventually fail without another bailout. Extend and pretend bull****. Yeah they moved the breakeven point down big deal. I think the badwill will destroy any chance these clowns have especially in a global depression.
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2009-10-22 00:05:57
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Kylafoon Posts: 717 Incept: 2009-02-05
Zombie Portal Lookout
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What is it about our rotting economy that still smells good to investors? Only maggots eat rotten flesh. Who are these magical maggots? ---------- "...But whenever we see things done wildly, but taken tamely, then the State is growing insane..." - Gilbert Keith Chesterton 1910
2009-10-22 00:13:05
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Audi04 Posts: 2 Incept: 2009-03-05 new york state
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long time lurker, first time posting. If I'm not mistaken, Ford didn't qualify for the first round of bailout money because all their assets( including the blue oval logo) were already encumbered. From what I have read on the auto blogs Ford borrowed heavily against all assets, probably a smart move, but, IMHO,This move doesn't make them a better car company or more deserving of our patronage. Unfortunately,all domestic automobile producers are improving, too little, too late.I live in an area of upstate NY that was heavily dependent on Ford/GM. Losses here are staggering, we will not recover in my lifetime. OT thanks Karl and all the other regular posters for "getting me into a good place"
2009-10-22 03:33:27
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Drjerry Posts: 352 Incept: 2007-11-06 Vancouver
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Audi04 Welcome. Remember at Ford most of their upper management and major stockholders have the same last name. <Hint: It's on the front of the building> I worked for Chrysler Canada in the 1980s/1990s. Midlevel where I was seemed to be really nice people. Thoroughly incompetent for the most part, but nice people. I never could figure out how they stayed in business. One day some guy I had never seen before came into my area and started asking questions. I really unloaded on him all the time wondering why this outfit couldn't hire a draftsman that could speak English. He thanked me and left. Then I found out I was talking to Dr Z. ---------- When Americans say they live in the greatest country in the world it's just because they've never been to Canada... Author unknown
2009-10-22 03:54:37
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Misterb Posts: 426 Incept: 2007-08-02
Minnesota
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I don't think that GM even needs to report any profit and loss statements as a private company.(?) I think just about everyone thinks that GM and Chrysler will fail again; i.e., that they will run out of cash. In order to save face, it seems unlikely that the Obama Administration will allow either company to fail. They will give the companies more money with a "new plan" to save the company. The only other face saving measure would be to "sell" parts of Chrysler to other companies. I can not see that option with GM because it is too big. Maybe, the government could wind down these companies by cutting off advertising and new car development to save cash.
2009-10-22 19:17:17
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