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| User Info | Government Violates The Citizens (Again) in forum [Ticker] | |||
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Genesis Posts: 71432 Incept: 2007-06-26 
KD^2 
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http://market-ticker.org/archives/1503-G....
---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-10-10 15:32:04
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Pojo Posts: 34 Incept: 2009-08-05
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this gov is not based on 'we the people...' anymore
2009-10-10 15:54:09
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Bluebird Posts: 524 Incept: 2008-05-02 
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Few people protest nowadays because they have been repeatedly told to think positively, no matter the circumstances. If you've been handed lemons, make lemonaid. People are too trusting of the government that it's looking out for their best interests. Many people aren't aware that they've been violated, and won't be until it's too late.
2009-10-10 16:15:02
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Onion Posts: 65 Incept: 2008-04-05
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These games are also happening in the UK with local councils providing 'free' loans to first-time-buyers who cannot afford a deposit so long as their income is below a certain threshold. They describe this policy, which props up asset prices, as a route to affordable housing for the poor. Very Orwellian An ex-member of the BoE MPC, David Blanchflower, wrote the following in the Guardian today: Quote:Moderate inflation would help all the people in negative equity; rising asset prices would certainly help, and are one of the stated purposes of quantitative easing. A few years of inflation, around 5% or so, would be a really good idea. Keep interest rates low for the foreseeable future, keep the stimulus going. http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/.... They're not even bothering to hide the fact they wish to steal from prudent savers.
2009-10-10 16:16:12
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Epicdepressive Posts: 1351 Incept: 2009-04-04
this old bunker
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I want to fight back at the city/county level. After all: land deeds and ownership are officially registered at the county court house. My haunted house index for my country has begun to go parabolic over the last 4 months. An abandoned home pays no property tax. An abandoned home pays nothing to the local utility company. These homes are in foreclosure limbo. My neighbors suffered a reduction in income and most likely an ARM reset increase from a fly-by-night out-of-state lender. They simply moved out 5 months ago. TBTF entity, GMAC finance, gave notice of foreclosure at least 3 months ago and is now attempting "loss mitigation" or rather: it wants a jab a "sloppy fourths" on a worthless IOU. The IOU (mortgage) trail goes as such: 1) fly-by-night, out-of-state mortgage lender made loan (it failed 2.5y ago) 2) WAMU (it failed ~1.5y ago) 3) MERS (It was held by MERS for a month or more and no forclosure notice was sent during this time - as far as I know) 4) Now GMAC finance owns the worthless IOU The house rots vacant. The home owner has, by local law, 2 years to make good on property taxes and re-claim the property. The house, or rather the "security" which backs the debt needs extensive repair. In fact: it is in such a sorry state that it would be a crime to sell it as a place of human habitation. The "bank", GMAC finance has yet to inspect and appraise their new "asset". The cost of demolition and disposal of the property could very well equal the current appraised value of the lot (land only) (IMHO this value is reasonable if the lot was a blank slate). On this, I would argue that this "property" is worth nothing and the bank is attempting collection of an unsecured debt. Why do I care? 1) It is blighting our neighborhood. 2) GMAC finance has probably booked 3 months of "money good" interest payments out of thin air and won't put the thing on the market until after every hopeless attempt at a "mortgage work out" has been exhausted. 3) GMAC finance cares not about the securities (homes) that back the credit(debt) which is among the asset foundation of ALLY bank. It sounds like you have sympathy for your former neighbor. Do you? A: No. I care only about the dilapidated structure which is blighting our adjacent property. I cleaned up a good deal of garbage that was be-spoiling the view from our windows. A: By prolonging the foreclosure process GMAC Finance is forcing property liability onto an un-interested party (the former neighbors) while it (GMAC finance) will (I expect) decline any attempt the homeowner may make at an honest short sale. We neighbors would buy the property for what it is worth. We know it better than anyone else. We know that it ain't worth much. Extend, pretend, property condemned; then AIG amend. ---------- What do you want? What do you value? What do you need? What in exchange? Last modified:
2009-10-10 16:46:13 by epicdepressive
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Etz3l Posts: 9103 Incept: 2007-06-26 
Online
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Quote:"I don’t think it’s a bad thing that the bad loans occurred," he said. "It was an effort to keep prices from falling too fast. That’s a policy."****sucker! ---------- Treating the symptoms of financial corruption isn’t the same as removing the causes.
2009-10-10 16:48:08
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Epicdepressive Posts: 1351 Incept: 2009-04-04
this old bunker
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www.revbilly.org (Church of stop shopping) My understanding is that the UK has strong "squatters rights" laws. Why ink your John Han**** when you can just move in and camp out? ---------- What do you want? What do you value? What do you need? What in exchange?
2009-10-10 16:51:03
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Mdporter Posts: 68 Incept: 2008-02-26 San Jose, CA
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Meanwhile the prudent continue to get ****d while the freespenders enjoy the spoils of their spending, living in foreclosed homes rent free. *I* didn't ask for this.
2009-10-10 16:51:12
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Ilikecoffee Posts: 1019 Incept: 2008-04-17
cold , AK
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Most people still have something to lose.
---------- You can trust the government, ask any American Indian. "When people lose everything and they have nothing left to lose, they lose it" Gerald Celente
2009-10-10 16:55:51
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Trades50 Posts: 1144 Incept: 2007-10-30
IL Online
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The only time Americans will react is when every last dime has been swindled from them and they can no longer afford to live. Otherwise, Fraud Street can keep stealing. Afterwords it's a real opportunity for a tyrant to take over. ---------- Labor for the Globalist: World Class means Third World Class.
2009-10-10 16:58:38
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Gamma Posts: 1760 Incept: 2008-01-20
Northern CA
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"One in six American households currently receive food stamps and according to a report by Deutche Bank 40% of homes will be under water on their mortgage by 2011." I find this hard to believe. ---------- It's better to donate a Ford to the Kidney Foundation than a Kidney to the Ford Foundation.
2009-10-10 16:59:06
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Hihoherewego Posts: 595 Incept: 2009-02-25
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I honestly don't know what you're concerned about here, Denninger. Oh hell. We have American Idol, flat screen teevees, toilets with running water, gas, power, waste disposal, and the big one: grand supermarkets with plenty and pretty damn cheap food. Until most of all that goes away en masse this ain't sheeit in the vast majority of American minds right now. They could GAFF about banks ripping them off through back channel shenanigans. They understand this ain't no perfect world brother. Besides it's a lot more fun to party and leave the worrying to wonks such as yourself, right? ......................... http://www.usdebtclock.org/
2009-10-10 17:06:44
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Epicdepressive Posts: 1351 Incept: 2009-04-04
this old bunker
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American Idol requires electricity for viewing. The ute. companies are in a bad financial way. Flat screen TVs don't last forever and are thrown out when they fail instead of salvaging the picture grill to make a 100 inch projection TV. The municipal sewage systems are aged and many are decades overdue for upkeep. Water. May we have our wonderful, piped water. Gas: people fail to insulate and seal. They squander $250 on heating bills when they could cut that way down and save for "rainy days" by only heating bedrooms at night and such. Here in USA we heat all 3,500 square feet of our high-ceiling McMansions even when only 2 people live there and one is usually away on business. Electric: long live the age of electricity! Poor people are steeling idle power lines and selling the copper for scrap (most high tension is aluminum; these were old lines) The copper goes into the market and China buys it up. Waste disposal: see movie "Idiocracy" Supermarkets w/ cheap food: yeah, only b/c Goldman Sacks is propping their losses and the Fed props agri-commodities and many supermarket locations are "over capacity" problems along with "credit recession". The vast majority will go hungry and cold and many will die. Such is life in the Condratiff economic winter. ---------- What do you want? What do you value? What do you need? What in exchange?
2009-10-10 17:29:06
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Statusquojoe Posts: 2397 Incept: 2008-11-20
Land of the fees Home of the slaves.
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Quote:Yet America's slumber continues, as does my amazement. Must be something in the water. We are a disgrace to our founding fathers, incremental socialism has done its job so well, people don't know the difference between a hate crime or a bank crime. The will scream bloody murder if a puppy gets killed or a horned owl hasn't a nest but its okay for them to loose 75% of their purchasing power in a decade. The frog in a pot metaphor works so well......... ---------- "In short, you are the definition of moral hazard." Senator Bunning to Bernanke
2009-10-10 17:32:18
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Boilinmad Posts: 522 Incept: 2009-04-03
Michigan
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Gen, You know I'm not financialy educated like some here, so I haven't contributed on these types of threads until now. But I really get what you're saying and I have tried to stir up some interest in this subject among my acquaintances to no avail. They find me depressing, however, I have been writing and calling my "representatives" even tho they ignore me. Your estimate of the $5 gallon of gas is probably conservative and I understand why you reference it because you think J6P will understand. That said, my biggest fear is the inevitable massive increase in the cost of electricity and home heating fuel. I try to explain that we are an import dependent nation and with a devaluation of the dollar, electricity will go sky high. Forget about non coal generating power plants. Oh, and the petroleum needed to extract the coal? So the price has to go up and the more people can't afford to pay for the increased cost of electricity, the more the price will have to increase. Winter is bearing down on us and they ran out of home heating assistance last year mid February. People were begging at the churches and charities and they ran out of funds. This year will be worse even without a price increase. I'd like to cut off Barney's useless balls. ---------- Unlike the US, Japan cannot export its money in return for the rest of the World´s goods. It must export goods for the rest of the world´s money. Frank R. Suess
2009-10-10 17:45:57
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Trades50 Posts: 1144 Incept: 2007-10-30
IL Online
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Limit the 2nd Amendment (rumblings in Washington to limit gun ownership to the military and police) and the US is setting itself up so it's citizens can't fight back. All steps to move away from a republic.
---------- Labor for the Globalist: World Class means Third World Class.
2009-10-10 17:47:39
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T2 Posts: 364 Incept: 2008-11-17
Los Angeles
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A million people marched on the capital recently about this very issue and the media poo poo'd it as a bunch of racist malcontents who hate Obama because he's black. The media is very sympathetic to the current party in power and won't do anything to rock the boat, including covering up for their corruption, poor policies, and outright theft. All these things were pointed out in spades during the last administration but now that we've got Obama at the helm the consensus seems to be that we just need more time for turbo tim's policies to work, even though they're no different than Paulson's. This in turn is all the general population hears about and thus believes. People I know who seem intelligent think that getting helathcare "reform" is the most important agenda item on the docket right now since it seems that the bleeding from their 401ks has not only stopped, but significantly reversed itself. I was out having dinner last night with a friend who was commenting about how pretty much all of his investments have recouped their losses. He asked me if I was still listening to "that doom and gloomer Denninger guy" who, he pointed out had you listened to his screeds off the March lows you would have totally missed the move this year. I pointed out that had one listened to him in March of 2008 they never would have has the losses to begin with. He at least agreed with that. I think that people pretty much don't know or don't care about all this because they're too distracted with living their day to day lives. America's Got Talent is still on TV, their 401ks are going back up, and while a lot of people don't have jobs most still do so everything can't be that bad. If the government needs to take these "extraordinary" measures the ensure the recession ends, then so be it, I suspect. ---------- ------------------------------------------ In California, no one can hear you scream.
2009-10-10 17:57:04
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Genesis Posts: 71432 Incept: 2007-06-26
KD^2
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Quote:A million people marched on the capital recently about this very issue and the media poo poo'd it as a bunch of racist malcontents who hate Obama because he's black. If they had surrounded the Capitol and refused to leave, it wouldn't have been ignored. ---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-10-10 18:28:15
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Mike57 Posts: 352 Incept: 2009-03-10 Bethlehem, PA.
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Headlines in my local paper yesterday were PP+L (Penna. Power and Light) 30% rate hike for 2010. So my electric bill will be 30% more next year, my car, house and health insurance also went up. RCN cable + internet now up to $149/month. Not seeing any deflation in basic living expenses here.
2009-10-10 18:36:42
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Eaglewwit Posts: 1890 Incept: 2007-11-30 SoCal
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So Gen are you capitulating a bit to the inflationist side?
---------- "Not even I imagined we would see trillions of dollars being created and given to the culprits as a means of allegedly "saving" the system. This is not mere Keynesianism; it is Keynesianism on steroids and crystal meth."
2009-10-10 18:42:18
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Genesis Posts: 71432 Incept: 2007-06-26
KD^2
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Jesus Christ... again?
---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-10-10 18:47:06
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Froghat Posts: 213 Incept: 2009-01-28 Banned
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INFLATION! Book it!
2009-10-10 18:48:11
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Wawawa Posts: 104 Incept: 2009-03-18 San Diego, CA
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""One in six American households currently receive food stamps and according to a report by Deutche Bank 40% of homes will be under water on their mortgage by 2011." I find this hard to believe." According to US Department of agriculture by Jul 2009, 16.2 Million households were receiving Supplemental Nutrition Assistance. That is about 15% of the US house holds. http://www.fns.usda.gov/pd/34SNAPmonthly.... ---------- RAT RACE IS OVER, RATS WON :) Last modified:
2009-10-10 18:51:06 by wawawa
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Bluebird Posts: 524 Incept: 2008-05-02
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T2 said "If the government needs to take these "extraordinary" measures the ensure the recession ends, then so be it" I have a sibling who said exactly that, and that the recession appears to be about over. Life is still good.
2009-10-10 19:03:39
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Tickerfan Posts: 1267 Incept: 2008-01-02
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Genesis, the point at which I always seem to lose you is where you imply that the hapless homeowners who are being foreclosed upon were bilked out of their investments. Well, in a very theoretical sense, I suppose one could argue that we were all bilked out of our investments as the result of the unsustainable catapaulting of asset prices that was the direct result of the financial institutions' machinations, but I don't see you suggesting that I should be similarly indignant over my losses on UNG. Why do you not hold these underwater homeowners accountable for their losses? Was there something deceptive about the language of the promissory notes and deeds of trust that these individuals signed--or something that induced them to forego consulting a lawyer about what would likely be the most significant purchase of their life? Was there some sort of duress or undue influence involved? You imply that the loans to these individuals were fraudulent because the institutions making them knew that there was a substantial certainty they could not be repaid. Who would be better positioned to know this than the borrower himself? I ask these questions because I cannot, for the life of me, see how this country has any chance of getting back on track unless we bring back accountability--not only for the financial institutions, but for Joe and Jane Sixpack who, when all is said and done, chose to sign on the dotted line. And I find it puzzling that for someone who regards individual responsibility as highly as you do, that underwater homeowners have somehow managed to escape your wrath. Last modified:
2009-10-10 19:29:00 by tickerfan
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