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| User Info | Bush Capitulates, Treasuries and GM in forum [Ticker] | |||
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Genesis Posts: 66462 Incept: 2007-06-26 
Royal Flush! 
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http://market-ticker.org/archives/662-Bu....
---------- I used to play flute; I wonder if I can play a fife? I incite prosecutors to create "Bubba Sausage Parking Lot" projects Darrell Issa has a middle finger and knows how to use it - Me 2008-11-18 08:07:39
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Baldy Posts: 6203 Incept: 2008-05-16 
Pittsburgh
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RE: Automakers- this video was posted in General by Macneib- it shows a VERY mechanized Ford plant in Brazil... Would have saved Ford in the US if they had this here? http://info.detnews.com/video/index.cfm?....
---------- Short term Treasury rates 1920-1941 monthly - note: some months the average was negative (2 page PDF) http://fraser.stlouisfed.org/publications/bms/page/409/61/download/409.pdf 2008-11-18 08:17:44
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Midwestman Posts: 1437 Incept: 2007-12-10
Indiana
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Gen, FWIW I do not think it is capitulation, I think it is another stick in the eye of the American public. But that is my opinion. More interesting news - did you know that Mark Cuban has been stirring things up about the bailout? He has a website http://www.bailoutsleuth.com/ which is following the money. Now the SEC is coming down on Cuban for alleged insider trading in 2004! I guess Cuban is also "Fair Game". The SEC suddenly seems to have enough staff to investigate wrongdoing, at least of critics and dissenters it seems. 2008-11-18 08:20:54
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Red_arrow Posts: 83 Incept: 2008-11-01 Florida
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Quote:Further, there's no reason reason to use the rest of the money anyway. You're being two reasonable.. 
---------- Go to Jail. Go directly to Jail. Do not pass GO. Do not collect $200 Billion. 2008-11-18 08:22:57
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Wrldtrst Posts: 38 Incept: 2008-06-27 Chicago or Rio
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It just amazes me how counter intuitive peoples reactions always are with this one, and just how important a part of this it is. "No bailouts. Period. Unsupportable debt must be defaulted. Do it, get it out in the open, and get it over with. Yes, its going to suck, but its going to suck no matter what we do. We can either have it suck hard and short, or far worse and far longer. The more we screw around with this the worse it is going to be." Perfectly stated!!! 2008-11-18 08:26:14
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Midwestman Posts: 1437 Incept: 2007-12-10
Indiana
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Baldy, The plant opened in 2001. Ford's problems are much older than that. Secondly the design with the suppliers in house was probably necessary bcos there are no existing suppliers in that area, so it makes sense to put everything in one place. Brazil is a lovely country but it does not have the infrastructure in place outside major cities. FWIW Ford used to have plants like this in the US, the River Rouge plant - they started with iron ore and output cars from one spot. I don't think it was the UAW that broke that. Feel free to Google River Rouge, I will be doing so myself. :-) I am not a UAW sympathizer - my beef is simple - Big 3 management KNEW they were running unsustainable companies for a couple of decades now. They basically did nothing constructive to fix it. They just used the Michigan politicians to buy themselves govt subsidies and legal favoritism. Abuse of power, abuse of goodwill, yada yada. If we blame only the UAW or only the management or only the Michigan delegation in Congress, we will be stroking ourselves and not addressing the real issues. 2008-11-18 08:29:21
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Widgeon Posts: 5671 Incept: 2007-08-30
OK
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AMEN <<I am not a UAW sympathizer - my beef is simple - Big 3 management KNEW they were running unsustainable companies for a couple of decades now. They basically did nothing constructive to fix it. They just used the Michigan politicians to buy themselves govt subsidies and legal favoritism. Abuse of power, abuse of goodwill, yada yada. If we blame only the UAW or only the management or only the Michigan delegation in Congress, we will be stroking ourselves and not addressing the real issues. >> 2008-11-18 08:38:34
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Wthef Posts: 601 Incept: 2008-02-25 
philadelphia
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"If the UAW, GM, Ford and Chrysler can't compete with these other firms on our own soil in a down economy that's just too damn bad - its time for us to drive American-built Toyotas and tell GM management and the UAW to stick it in their ear!" AMEN!!!!!!! Why we continue to treat these company's and the labor like 2 year olds is beyond me...my kids have more common sence than the uaw ---------- "I had to look at her today and sat there staring at her bronze naked body laying in the sun, a flaming red candle in her hand she took me in. Her figure consumed me 36-32-34 and said "take me" I stumbled forward as I engaged her stare and she pulled me down towards her. I ripped off my shirt and dropped my pants, we f 2008-11-18 08:40:37
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Asianbull Posts: 2125 Incept: 2007-09-03
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The next generation vehicles will be electric. Looks like we may have already lost that battle: http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/739ed148-a946-.... ---------- The root cause of all the world's problems is inflation. The only sound money in the world is commodities. 2008-11-18 08:50:43
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Eb Posts: 370 Incept: 2008-11-11
Virginia Suspended
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Everyone seems to be ignoring the story about denominating our Treasuries in foreign currency. Does this not sound absolutely insane? What about the Europeans currently getting bent over because they have home mortgages denominated in foreign currencies? Is that to be our fate? That is one of the single most disturbing trends to arise out of this mess. In addition Gen, a move to denominate Treasuries in other currencies would mean the end of the US dollar as a reserve currency. It would not be good for the United States. Time to cut back now.
2008-11-18 08:53:33
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Barracuda Posts: 35 Incept: 2007-06-26 Corrupticut
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If the Unions won't give up anything, why doesn't Paulson/Bernanke & Co., who seem to be running the Country, force those Unions to use their pension funds to BUY THOSE AUTO COMPANIES.
2008-11-18 08:57:06
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2banana Posts: 84 Incept: 2008-02-25
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The Big Three Auto Bailout = Funding Union pensions and benefits. Obama and democrats owe the union for this election. Any questions? 2008-11-18 09:16:07
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Mango Posts: 218 Incept: 2008-02-08
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Quote:hang the greenies up by their toenails...throw the Greenies and Weenies in the Love Canal my oh my! You know, I like to refer people to your tickers now and then....please save that for kind of talk for deep recesses of the forum. ---------- "Wall Street should be asking us for Bail, not Bailouts" T. M. O'Sullivan 2008-11-18 09:32:08
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Fortune Posts: 1384 Incept: 2008-04-21 A deep dark place...scary
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Listening to the rant by Barney Frank just now, it is immediately obvious, again, that your point #4 is simply not going to happen. Should happen, yes, but will happen, no. Too many Barney Franks out there.
---------- It's a toss up. It is the Rule of Law that transforms assets into money: Martin Armstrong Math IS: Karl Denninger Legitimate questions deserve answers: Janet Tavakoli 2008-11-18 09:41:34
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Sloonie Posts: 401 Incept: 2008-04-16
waaaaay up North
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first line spell alert... financial-rescue package. reads rescerue. Thanks as always, KD Last modified:
2008-11-18 10:43:41 by sloonie
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Chainlink Posts: 411 Incept: 2008-10-26
Florida and Michigan
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Amen, Gen on Greenies and Weenies! Remember in early 2007, Consumer Reports made a huge mistake on baby car seat crash data? The fact that such a massive error even made it to publication, let alone squeaked past in-house review, shows how pathetic we are in letting bogus safety stuff and and bad science ruin real production. Personally, I think this Consumer Reports mistake was a major news story...how many other "mistakes" turn into law? Part per thousand regulations for part per billion issues. Fear of nuclear, CO2, a trillionth of natural element in air or water. I tell my good Ford engineer friends - keep the machinery and infrastructure that makes your heaviest parts, steel, and chassis full up and running. Gonna need it for the war effort in a few years. 2008-11-18 09:57:53
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Noodleman Posts: 404 Incept: 2008-11-01
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KD nailed this one. I concur that we've reached that 'come to Jesus' fork in the road. The average american is completely oblivious to what lies ahead. Looking at the federal budget the 3 biggies are Defense, Health and Human Services and Social Security to the tune of about $2.1 trillion or more annually. No one wants to end up on the short end of the stick. Tough choices are mandatory. Illegal foreigners collect about $50 billion. Without a doubt that should be the first to go. The trough feeders collecting transfer payments will need to make do with less. The defense contractors should get less war money. SS? Tough one. Minimum age will have to be increased. Do the politicians have the will to do what's needed? No. As usual, a mega crisis will force them into it. 2008-11-18 10:22:25
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Rbarber Posts: 16 Incept: 2008-05-11
NY
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"America needs to adjust down its economic expectations". I couldn't agree more. The problem is, no politician is going to go on TV and say, "Americans need to get used to a 20-40% reduction in the standard of living or we face the risk of a national bankruptcy". OK. Maybe 1 - Ron Paul. And we see how much infuence he has in Congress. Instead we get the Hon. B. Frank. Americans don't want to hear anything that resembles the truth. They want to continue to: buy houses bigger then they need/can afford, buy cars/trucks/SUVs bigger then they need/can afford, expect healtcare bigger and better then they need/can afford, enjoy eating out more then they need/can afford, shopping more then they need/can afford, bigger govt then they need/can afford, ... A perfect example of this is: "change we can believe in". Such a vacous statement that it means nothing. Neither candidate talked about making hard choices. Given the tax cuts that WILL GET PASSED, ~ 45% of Americans will not pay 1 cent in Federal Income taxes within 2 years. Soon the majority of Americans will get the Federal govt for free. Can't argue with price! Just another example of a joke I like, "never underestimate the average American's expectation of getting something for nothing". ---------- "We have to shoot and kill and destroy. We represent everything that's wholesome and good in the world." Maxwell Smart 2008-11-18 10:36:20
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Themortgagedude Posts: 3343 Incept: 2007-12-17
saint louis
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Gen, Some people are going to praise you for this ticker. Oh its great - blah, blah What it truly comes down to is you have the ability to formulate your thoughts onto paper better than anyone else in the common sense brigade. All that you mention is just common sense, nothing more. And what it comes down to is we are a nation of ostriches with our heads in the sand. Nobody wants to confront the truth. Its ok to buy a Ford Tauras and borrow $15,000 if you need it to get to work and cash flow works for you on it. Its not OK to buy a $65,000 Escalade and borrow $72,000 for it, just to have the car you want. It's OK for .gov to build a new road or a bridge or support the defense of our nation. Its not OK to borrow money from future generations to fight wars that are unwinnable, to pay for entitlements not saved for, etc. Paying hundreds of thousands in the final year of someones life to keep a 85 year old alive is just stupid. So many problems that it doesn't take a genius to point out and you hammer it home so eloquently. Not trying to take anything away as your ability to dissect problems is outstanding, it's just that I always enjoy the tickers when you hammer home common sense points against the fraudsters on WS and in DC. I guess that's cause I can understand those. 
---------- Since September it's just gotten colder and colder. There's less daylight now, I've noticed too. This can only mean one thing - the sun is going out. In a few more months the Earth will be a dark and lifeless ball of ice. 2008-11-18 10:43:12
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Uncleoxidant Posts: 1575 Incept: 2007-07-10 Stumptown
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Diesel cars that get 60MPG (or better in some cases) are green. I think most "greenies" would buy them if they could. It's the EPA regs that stop it. EPA does not necessarily equal "green".
---------- Debt is slavery 2008-11-18 11:46:11
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Eb Posts: 370 Incept: 2008-11-11
Virginia Suspended
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I have been advocating diesel for a long time. I sent this very same proposal to the Obama team as a policy position they could use in the general election. No follow up from that team. Go figure.
2008-11-18 11:47:38
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Deejunk Posts: 389 Incept: 2008-10-11 Now DC - Solar Power.
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Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson and Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke were "grilled" on Capital Hill about their management of a $700 billion financial bailout. What is wrong WITH THE MEDIA? Who will bring the bah-b-q sauce?  Then the Dow goes up? WTF? ---------- If the egg won't hatch... Fry it! Ready for serious inflation, deflation & collapse of the US & Global economic & market systems?  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fm4iU0yx9....2008-11-18 11:51:00
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Trailerpark Posts: 457 Incept: 2008-10-27
Trailerparkistan
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Hey Chainlink...nice avatar. What's it gonna take? Teamwork!
---------- You know, I have one simple request. And that is to have sharks with frickin' laser beams attached to their heads! "Now evidently my cycloptic colleague informs me that that cannot be done. Ah, would you remind me what I pay you people for, honestly? Throw me a bone here! What do we have?" - Dr. Evil 2008-11-18 12:01:27
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Jazumah Posts: 116 Incept: 2008-08-20 New York
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There is someone who thinks that currencies are going to be intentionally blown up and re-issued as three new currencies: a new dollar, a new Euro, and a new pan-Asian currency. http://mensnewsdaily.com/2008/11/15/the-.... 2008-11-18 12:45:54
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Txdomer Posts: 934 Incept: 2007-11-07
Locke'd and loaded.
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Uncleox, It's California, not the EPA, that sets emission standards in this country. As for health insurance, how about this, America:  ---------- "Economics is not practiced as a science. Rather, it is a pretentious way to covertly promote political prejudices." - Fred Harrison http://renegadeeconomist.com Last modified:
2008-11-18 13:27:15 by txdomer
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